Warner and Welles

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J Wilson · #26 Post by **J Wilson** » Wed Feb 22, 2006 10:10 pm

viciousliar wrote:
J Wilson wrote:In the case of JOURNEY, Warner will hopefully include both the American and European release versions, which feature different footage and endings. The Munich Filmmuseum has done a preliminary reconstruction combining the two, which would be cool to see also, but probably unlikely for Warner to include.
That's most interesting - is the European version per chance longer, and is it slightly darker in mood, if you happen to know? Please share.

No, the Euro version is more comedic, really. This Wellesnet thread details the differences fairly exhaustively. The upshot is that if you're looking for something darker and more noirish, this alternate cut isn't really it.

ellipsis7 · #27 Post by **ellipsis7** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 2:07 pm

Universal Pictures Video releases THE MAGNIFICENT AMBERSONS on R2 Pal DVD single disc on 24th April... Don't know how this would tie in to Warners R1...

The Fanciful Norwegian · #28 Post by **The Fanciful Norwegian** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:05 pm

My guess would be "not at all." I don't think there's ever been much overlap between Universal's RKO releases in R2 and Warners' in R1 -- the Universal Kane came out about eight months before the WB version and had a different transfer and different extras, and Universal had a near-barebones R2 version of King Kong four and a half years before Warners finally got around to releasing it in R1.

ellipsis7 · #29 Post by **ellipsis7** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:12 pm

I suppose that's true - what could Warner's offer as an extra? - maybe commentary by Robert Carringer, Rosenbaum or indeed Clinton Heylin... Or they may go for bare bones too, like some of the upcoming Warner Ford releases... Can't think of any docu that would be fitting, unless they pick up the THE ORSON WELLES STORY either as the BBC Arena 2 part original or as the single feature length re-edit for Turner...

yoshimori · #30 Post by **yoshimori** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:29 pm

ellipsis7 wrote:Universal Pictures Video releases THE MAGNIFICENT AMBERSONS on R2 Pal DVD single disc on 24th April...

Why do think so? This release is not (yet) listed at amazon or bensons or blackstar.

ellipsis7 · #31 Post by **ellipsis7** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:33 pm

Find it at Moviemail, usually first to post new UK releases here...

http://www.moviemail-online.co.uk/films/6461

Ste · #32 Post by **Ste** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:11 am

Belated thanks to Annie Mall for the dynamic list of Welles DVDs - very useful!

This may be old news, but for the sake of completeness may I suggest adding the Italian DVD of The Immortal Story to your list? It is essential viewing for Welles completists and, whilst it was originally made for French TV, it deserves a mention here every bit as much as, say, Don Quixote does.

You can read the WellesNet review here.

I purchased my copy from dvd.it. (Although the shipping cost more than the DVD itself!)

Lino · #33 Post by **Lino** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:43 am

Ste wrote:Belated thanks to Annie Mall for the dynamic list of Welles DVDs - very useful!

This may be old news, but for the sake of completeness may I suggest adding the Italian DVD of The Immortal Story to your list?

Thank you and consider it done! In fact, I already updated it. Thanks for this addition!

Narshty · #34 Post by **Narshty** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:32 pm

Dull cover art is up at Play.com for the UK Ambersons.

And, something about which I had no idea, Welles' radio adaptation has been released as a standalone CD. The eventual Warner edition is bound to include this (they love their radio plays even more than Criterion), but I'm not sure I can hold off.

jesus the mexican boi · #35 Post by **jesus the mexican boi** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:34 pm

Narshty wrote:Dull cover art is up at Play.com for the UK Ambersons

That is a fucking ugly cover. With all the beautiful shots in the picture, they go with THAT?

dx23 · #36 Post by **dx23** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:29 pm

Awful cover. Looks like a generic, public domain release.

ellipsis7 · #37 Post by **ellipsis7** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 2:17 pm

This postage stamp is up at moviemail, but the play.com one seems more genuine...

Gordon · #38 Post by **Gordon** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 2:44 pm

Yech. Cheapo cover art. It gives the impression of Film Noir. The capitalized impact font is also horrid.

That Moviemail cover is the old VHS art. Even for VHS, the transfer was horrendous. Has anyone, in the last ten years, seen a good print of Ambersons?

A repackaged Touch of Evil is also listed, with a 24th April street date. No sign of the Reconstructing Evil documentary or Curtis Hanson commentary, unsurprisingly.

Ste · #39 Post by **Ste** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 3:24 pm

But just look at all those subtitle options:

English for the hard of hearing ; Spanish ; German ; Arabic ; Danish ; Dutch ; Finnish ; Greek ; Hebrew ; Norwegian ; Portuguese ; Russian ; Swedish ; Turkish ; Italian ; French

ellipsis7 · #40 Post by **ellipsis7** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 3:47 pm

Which version of TOUCH OF EVIL - does not make clear?...

Ste · #41 Post by **Ste** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 4:02 pm

ellipsis7 wrote:Which version of TOUCH OF EVIL - does not make clear?...

Amazon UK lists a PAL running time of 105 minutes, which would make it the same as the existing UK DVD i.e. the 1998 re-edit.

ellipsis7 · #42 Post by **ellipsis7** » Wed May 31, 2006 5:16 am

Just received the Universal R2 UK/IRL disc of AMBERSONS... Slightly soft image but otherwise fine.. Main extra is interview with Bill Krohn speaking in French, subtitled in English!...

Scharphedin2 · #43 Post by **Scharphedin2** » Wed May 31, 2006 5:43 am

This may be old news, but for the sake of completeness may I suggest adding the Italian DVD of The Immortal Story to your list? It is essential viewing for Welles completists and, whilst it was originally made for French TV, it deserves a mention here every bit as much as, say, Don Quixote does.

Ste, can you (or someone else) post a few comments on the Italian THE IMMORTAL STORY disc. This is a film that I have always wanted to see. Does the DVD do it justice?

ellipsis7 · #44 Post by **ellipsis7** » Wed May 31, 2006 6:18 am

LA FEMME SUR LA PLAGE is well worth getting hold of... See the Beaver review which says it is probably a transfer from tape, producing some combing, but like it's the only show in town, and it's a very interesting movie...

Apropos of which, I have just read Janet Bergstrom's article ONEIRIC CINEMA - THE WOMAN ON THE BEACH... Excellent piece which fits with my theories of damaged physiques and psyches of males emerging from WWII in this film and THE RIVER, marking a key turning point in Renoir's cinema towards a more female proto feminist perspective...

Bergstrom's article works from the RKO archives, and the continuity scripts of the various versions, to chart the evolution of the project through script to the various edits, ultimately asserting that the final version (prepared by Renoir) is the significant achievement in terms of its elisions and foregrounding of certain plot elements...

So the Ed Montparnasse disc, is far from being a mangled version, with some lost holy grail of a director's cut lost in the mists of time and RKO archives... This is the finished and finest article...

Ste · #45 Post by **Ste** » Wed May 31, 2006 6:36 am

Scharphedin2 wrote:Ste, can you (or someone else) post a few comments on the Italian THE IMMORTAL STORY disc. This is a film that I have always wanted to see. Does the DVD do it justice?

I'm on holiday in the UK just now, so this'll have to be brief. (Don't you just hate using your parents' computer?)

The Immortal Story DVD is worth getting, I think, if you are a Welles completist. It's a simple little tale, filmed simply. It was made for TV, so it's not a big budget production, but it is classy enough. The gauzy photography reminds me a little of Tony Scott's The Hunger, if you know that one. A link to the WellesNet review can be found elsewhere in this thread, and that covers it fairly comprehensively.

There are three dubs -- with slightly different edits -- English, Italian, and French. Subtitles appear to be burned in. My little Cyberhome player usually ignores forced subs, but I can't remove these at all. That said, they are not too distracting. Picture quality is excellent; far better than the VHS, or the many bootlegs.

What else can I say? To coin the usual cliche, it ain't Citizen Kane, but if you enjoy Welles's minor work it's worth a look.

thomega · #46 Post by **thomega** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 5:02 pm

Chips_Critic wrote:The Warner R2 The Trial has two reels swapped around

I recently picked up the French StudioCanal and compared the 1963 cut to the Warner UK: the order of the reels is in the same order in both. I fully agree that the StudioCanal looks much better.

Lino · #47 Post by **Lino** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:11 pm

From this year's chat:

Elements for The Magnificent Ambersons has been found and that film and Journey into Fear will be released in 2008. Alternate European cuts will be included for Journey into Fear

Drucker · #48 Post by **Drucker** » Tue May 08, 2012 4:40 pm

Lino wrote:Ok, so to sum it up and kind of serve as reference for all of you out there like me who are trying to keep up with the best DVD versions of Welles' films, here it is, a dynamic list:

Seeing that The Trial is getting a Studio Canal release and with the good news that's been trickling in lately, can we update the list posted years ago? I don't see an "Orson Welles on DVD" thread...

Citizen Kane (1941) - Warner Blu Ray

The Magnificent Ambersons (1942) - The R1 DVD release by Warners seems to be best

It's All True (1943) - Paramount release from 2004 seems to be the only choice

The Stranger (1946) - The blu-ray is apparently DNRed to death, so MGM's R1 (from noir box) would probably be the best bet

The Lady from Shanghai (1947) - Columbia Classics edition

Macbeth (1948) - go for the french Wild Side 3xDVD (is this the same transfer as the UK single-disc?)

Othello (1952) - go for the UK R2

Mr. Arkadin (1955) - Criterion's Complete 3-Disc Set is the one to get

Touch of Evil (1958) - MoC's 2-Disc Blu-Ray only could be the best release of any Welles film!

The Trial (1962) - go for the the french Studio Canal edition--a Blu Ray is announced for Sept 3, 2012

Chimes at Midnight (1965) -The French Studio Canal edition is OOP and was quickly pulled, leaving the recently-released Mr. Bongo the one to beat pending some reviews in all likelihood (though it's in the wrong AR)

The Immortal Story (1968) - go for the italian edition, but Criterion has is streaming on Hulu Plus

F for Fake (1974) - Criterion and MoC both have excellent editions

Don Quijote de Orson Welles (1992) - wait, just grab yourselves a seat and wait

King Lear - is anything available but the E1 edition?

I'm happy to update this with links later on/some point this week

#49 Post by **swo17** » Tue May 08, 2012 5:04 pm

Olive Films recently acquired Macbeth. I wouldn't be surprised if a Blu-ray gets announced sometime this year.

martin · #50 Post by **martin** » Sat May 19, 2012 2:51 pm

Drucker wrote:Macbeth (1948) - go for the french Wild Side 3xDVD (is this the same transfer as the UK single-disc?)

No, those are different transfers (hugely different!). The UK Second Sight dvd has lots of scratches and dirt, and apparently no post-filtering. The French is heavily filtered, no scratches. Here is a comparison (beware that these images are not exact representaions of what the transfers look like. For instance, some cropping and resizing has been done. These grabs were made for another purpose several years ago, but they've been captured under similar circumstances and should be comparable). Top: French. Bottom: UK.

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