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Could be a number of things. Remember Dark Sky films initially planning a release of Kill, Baby Kill had it all printed and made out and then got sued for it because the rights were sold to Anchor Bay?

I believe MichaelB had said here before the idea of who owns what is very complicated for Italian and other European titles.

Arrow finally sorted out the US rights, and this is now coming out July 4th.

Wow, the transfer on this is stunning! Eye-searing primaries splashed on deep blacks throughout. It was worth the wait.

Is this the same Arrow Blood and Black Lace that has already been released in the UK, but is only now available from US Arrow in the US, rights issues having been cleared up? Or is it an upgrade?

There's only one release, now available in both territories.

The machine-readable side of the US and UK discs is absolutely identical - the only differences between the packages are minor localised ones (barcodes, copyright, BBFC).

They were supposed to be released simultaneously last year, but there was a rights snag on the US side.

Further proof Arrow's disc is a cropped compromise - http://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&a=0& ... 95&i=3&l=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Well this definitely proves the German disc has terrible colors at least.

Given the option between awful colours and a slightly cropped AR, I'd pick the latter, especially since the Arrow is such a handsome package altogether.

God that German disc looks HORRIBLE.

It looks like an old print, but legit to my eyes.

Not to pick a fight, but within this thread there are several examples of Bava scholars and some of the most respected film restoration experts and producers vouching for the accuracy and quality of the Arrow release. You may like the look of the disc, but your eyes enjoying it is in no way evidence of the objective quality of the alternative release.

"Compromise" suggests that Arrow made the best of what they had - but in fact they had access to a scan of the full negative area. So they could easily have shown all of the picture that the German disc is showing.

So why didn't they?

I suspect the answer is that this is nowhere near as clear-cut as Orlac is claiming. In particular, I'd like to know whether the camera is static or moving at the point of these screencaps, because there've been innumerable instances of people insisting that something is "cropped" when in fact the "missing" portion was clearly visible a few frames earlier or later.

Honestly, my issue with all this discussion is that when viewing the movie, the framing never bothered me at all. It never felt wrong, and when looking at all the other caps from caps-a-holic, I come to the same conclusion : it's virtually impossible to look at one and say "Hey ! This is wrong, this is how it should be !"

I've always felt the Arrow framing could very well be right, though I've come back from thinking it undeniably is so. However, the discussion always felt to me vastly exaggerated and in a way, it has been fascinating to see some people ranting and yelling about how one release is so wrong and the other dead right while feeling as a whole this was totally blown out of proportions.

But I guess it's good to see some consumers caring that much.

I think what happened is the opposite of Hellraiser III. Hellraiser III left the soundtrack left hand side unmasked, exposing stuff that shouldn't be seen. Here the right hand side has been falesly cropped.

Since Arrow chose never to fix the issues on Hellraiser III, and let them persist on the first two House films, I have drawn my own conclusions.

Orlac wrote:I think what happened is the opposite of Hellraiser III. Hellraiser III left the soundtrack left hand side unmasked, exposing stuff that shouldn't be seen. Here the right hand side has been falesly cropped.

Since Arrow chose never to fix the issues on Hellraiser III, and let them persist on the first two House films, I have drawn my own conclusions.

Which are almost certainly erroneous, since you're making the usual mistake of taking two sharply different situations involving different people and assuming that they have something in common.

I repeat: Arrow had access to the full negative area, and the framing was carried out in consultation with Tim Lucas, who I believe knows a thing or two about Mario Bava.

Note screencapture number 8. Unlike the other caps, it shows no extra information over the Arrow. It's framed identically to the Arrow width wise.

Why this is I doubt any of us can say for certain, but it's interesting. Perhaps this scene was hard matted and there is no additional information on the left and right? If this is the case, then it would be very strong evidence for the German master to be revealing more than it should throughout the rest of the film. It would mean that if the source used for the German master was projected as it has been framed digitally, then during this scene there would be obvious mattes visible on the side of the image, a good indication it was being projected incorrectly.

There may be other explanations but regardless it's a very curious coincidence that for this scene (and possibly others), the sides are framed at the exact same place...

Orlac wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 08, 2015 12:57 pm

This is me being OCD - why is the one note written in this movie "Where is the diary?" in German instead of Italian?

David M. wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:02 pm

It's a strange one. It's discussed on the commentary.

So I watched this the other week and went through all of the extras and booklet afterwards. I don't believe the note being in German is covered anywhere, even in the commentary. As I understand it, the film was restored from the original negative, so that doesn't necessarily explain it either.

TMDaines wrote: ↑

Tue Jan 18, 2022 5:08 am

Orlac wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 08, 2015 12:57 pm

This is me being OCD - why is the one note written in this movie "Where is the diary?" in German instead of Italian?

David M. wrote: ↑

Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:02 pm

It's a strange one. It's discussed on the commentary.

So I watched this the other week and went through all of the extras and booklet afterwards. I don't believe the note being in German is covered anywhere, even in the commentary. As I understand it, the film was restored from the original negative, so that doesn't necessarily explain it either.

Someone else raised this on another forum ages ago (I forget which) and apparently it's German in every version.

Diabolik DVD tweeted that Arrow's US release is OOP.

Orlac wrote: ↑

Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:03 pm

I think what happened is the opposite of Hellraiser III. Hellraiser III left the soundtrack left hand side unmasked, exposing stuff that shouldn't be seen. Here the right hand side has been falesly cropped.

Since Arrow chose never to fix the issues on Hellraiser III, and let them persist on the first two House films, I have drawn my own conclusions.

For example

BLOOD AND BLACK LACE - note empty space on left in German version, cropped person on right in Arrow version -

https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&...108495&i=3&l=0


HELLRAISER - note on Arrow version revealing mistake on the left, nothing on the right missing when the correct OAR is seen on the German version -

https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&...=65304&i=2&l=0

If Arrow could fix both these titles in UHD, bring it on!

Hopefully the Bava 4Ks start rolling out with the same force as the Argento and Fulci ones. Super stoked for this.

My jaw dropped when I saw the notification from Rarewaves. Hitting Refresh like a madman now on the Orbit page so I can redeem some of my credit for a copy.

Amazing announcement, the kind of thing you'd expect from Koch/Plaion than Arrow (big supporter of both, by the way).