Blood and Black Lace

Discuss DVDs and Blu-rays released from Arrow and the films on them.

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Banasa
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:35 am

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#151 Post by Banasa » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:12 pm

Could be a number of things. Remember Dark Sky films initially planning a release of Kill, Baby Kill had it all printed and made out and then got sued for it because the rights were sold to Anchor Bay? ](*,)

I believe MichaelB had said here before the idea of who owns what is very complicated for Italian and other European titles.

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swo17
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:25 am
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Re: Blood and Black Lace

#152 Post by swo17 » Fri Apr 08, 2016 11:37 am

Arrow finally sorted out the US rights, and this is now coming out July 4th.

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zedz
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 7:24 pm

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#153 Post by zedz » Sun Aug 14, 2016 11:31 pm

Wow, the transfer on this is stunning! Eye-searing primaries splashed on deep blacks throughout. It was worth the wait.

isakorg2
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 11:43 am

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#154 Post by isakorg2 » Mon Aug 15, 2016 5:45 am

Is this the same Arrow Blood and Black Lace that has already been released in the UK, but is only now available from US Arrow in the US, rights issues having been cleared up? Or is it an upgrade?

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swo17
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Re: Blood and Black Lace

#155 Post by swo17 » Mon Aug 15, 2016 10:49 am

There's only one release, now available in both territories.

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MichaelB
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Re: Blood and Black Lace

#156 Post by MichaelB » Mon Aug 15, 2016 11:15 am

The machine-readable side of the US and UK discs is absolutely identical - the only differences between the packages are minor localised ones (barcodes, copyright, BBFC).

They were supposed to be released simultaneously last year, but there was a rights snag on the US side.

Orlac
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:29 am

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#157 Post by Orlac » Sun Mar 18, 2018 8:36 pm

Further proof Arrow's disc is a cropped compromise - http://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&a=0& ... 95&i=3&l=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Drucker
Your Future our Drucker
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Re: Blood and Black Lace

#158 Post by Drucker » Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:57 pm

Well this definitely proves the German disc has terrible colors at least.

Robespierre
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:31 pm

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#159 Post by Robespierre » Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:38 pm

Given the option between awful colours and a slightly cropped AR, I'd pick the latter, especially since the Arrow is such a handsome package altogether.

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Alphonse Tram
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 11:32 am

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#160 Post by Alphonse Tram » Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:13 am

God that German disc looks HORRIBLE.

Orlac
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:29 am

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#161 Post by Orlac » Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:32 am

It looks like an old print, but legit to my eyes.

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Drucker
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Re: Blood and Black Lace

#162 Post by Drucker » Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:40 am

Not to pick a fight, but within this thread there are several examples of Bava scholars and some of the most respected film restoration experts and producers vouching for the accuracy and quality of the Arrow release. You may like the look of the disc, but your eyes enjoying it is in no way evidence of the objective quality of the alternative release.

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MichaelB
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Re: Blood and Black Lace

#163 Post by MichaelB » Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:41 am

"Compromise" suggests that Arrow made the best of what they had - but in fact they had access to a scan of the full negative area. So they could easily have shown all of the picture that the German disc is showing.

So why didn't they?

I suspect the answer is that this is nowhere near as clear-cut as Orlac is claiming. In particular, I'd like to know whether the camera is static or moving at the point of these screencaps, because there've been innumerable instances of people insisting that something is "cropped" when in fact the "missing" portion was clearly visible a few frames earlier or later.

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tenia
Ask Me About My Bassoon
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:13 am

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#164 Post by tenia » Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:52 am

Honestly, my issue with all this discussion is that when viewing the movie, the framing never bothered me at all. It never felt wrong, and when looking at all the other caps from caps-a-holic, I come to the same conclusion : it's virtually impossible to look at one and say "Hey ! This is wrong, this is how it should be !"

I've always felt the Arrow framing could very well be right, though I've come back from thinking it undeniably is so. However, the discussion always felt to me vastly exaggerated and in a way, it has been fascinating to see some people ranting and yelling about how one release is so wrong and the other dead right while feeling as a whole this was totally blown out of proportions.

But I guess it's good to see some consumers caring that much.

Orlac
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:29 am

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#165 Post by Orlac » Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:03 pm

I think what happened is the opposite of Hellraiser III. Hellraiser III left the soundtrack left hand side unmasked, exposing stuff that shouldn't be seen. Here the right hand side has been falesly cropped.

Since Arrow chose never to fix the issues on Hellraiser III, and let them persist on the first two House films, I have drawn my own conclusions.

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MichaelB
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Re: Blood and Black Lace

#166 Post by MichaelB » Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:19 pm

Orlac wrote:I think what happened is the opposite of Hellraiser III. Hellraiser III left the soundtrack left hand side unmasked, exposing stuff that shouldn't be seen. Here the right hand side has been falesly cropped.

Since Arrow chose never to fix the issues on Hellraiser III, and let them persist on the first two House films, I have drawn my own conclusions.
Which are almost certainly erroneous, since you're making the usual mistake of taking two sharply different situations involving different people and assuming that they have something in common.

I repeat: Arrow had access to the full negative area, and the framing was carried out in consultation with Tim Lucas, who I believe knows a thing or two about Mario Bava.

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EddieLarkin
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:25 am

Re: Blood and Black Lace

#167 Post by EddieLarkin » Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:57 pm

Note screencapture number 8. Unlike the other caps, it shows no extra information over the Arrow. It's framed identically to the Arrow width wise.

Why this is I doubt any of us can say for certain, but it's interesting. Perhaps this scene was hard matted and there is no additional information on the left and right? If this is the case, then it would be very strong evidence for the German master to be revealing more than it should throughout the rest of the film. It would mean that if the source used for the German master was projected as it has been framed digitally, then during this scene there would be obvious mattes visible on the side of the image, a good indication it was being projected incorrectly.

There may be other explanations but regardless it's a very curious coincidence that for this scene (and possibly others), the sides are framed at the exact same place...

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