Who Gives Good Commentary?

[colinr0380]

I binge-watched several commentaries as I was cleaning house this past week (with little watching and mostly listening), and I was mightily impressed by the two tracks recorded for Three Kings. The standard Blu-ray has become dirt cheap as it's old, having been in-print for a very long time now, but the extras were produced at the height of the DVD market, when studios poured more resources into them - both commentaries are worth hearing, but Russell's is especially good, giving one a detailed idea of what it's like to make a movie for a major studio, including all the advantages and disadvantages one would find.

I have not as yet upgraded to Blu-ray (I still have the 2000 snapper case DVD edition!), but I still vividly remember the commentary to Three Kings being my first introduction to the "close enough for government work" approach to casting extras who look the part but were not of the specific affinity they were playing on screen. Which of course makes sense since the film was shot in Arizona rather than actually in Iraq, but whilst I'm not usually a stickler for someone of a particular race or ideology having to play a specific part (especially not for the way that argument is now used as a weapon to overwhelm any other considerations in the current day), just finding that bit of information in the commentary kind of opened my eyes to the idea (that probably should have always been obvious, but I'm slow!) that this was all coming from one particular side's perspective on the Iraq war, even down to the 'ethnically correct' extras being American! Or at least American-sympathetic to the extent that they were working in Arizona!

(Of course something like Memoirs of a Geisha a few years later, where the majority of the Japanese characters were played by Chinese actors - because, arguably understandably in practical terms, those were the Asian actors who had big enough names to be in vogue in Hollywood at the time post-Crouching Tiger compared to any Japanese ones - kind of trumped that in terms of 'racially correct yet ethnically wonky, but cross fingers that nobody will notice' casting choices!)

[Maltic]

One per director:

1. Killer of Sheep (Burnett, w Richard Peña)
2. Innerspace (Dante, w cast/crew)
3. Point Blank (Boorman, w Steven Soderbergh)
4. The Hunt for Red October (McTiernan)
5. Blood Simple (select-scene, Coens w Sonnenfeld)
6. Light Sleeper (Schrader)
7. Big Trouble in Little China (Carpenter, w Kurt Russell)
8. Used Cars (Zemeckis, w Gale/Russell)
9. Ride the Whirlwind (Hellman, w Bill Krohn)
10. Pit and the Pendulum (Corman)

I haven't listened to any with Cronenberg or Verhoeven or David O. Russell, but indeed, good interviewees usually make good commentators.

William Beard, who wrote a good book on Cronenberg's films, also did a handful of commentaries, including M Butterfly. He doesn't have much in the way of production notes, so they probably complement Cronenberg's own commentaries well.

[beamish14]

I mentioned this much earlier in the thread, but Used Cars is pretty much the gold standard for commentaries.

I’ve grown beyond him, but Kevin Smith’s cast/crew commentaries were hysterical to me when I first heard them, and I particularly enjoy the ones for Clerks: The Animated Series

I haven’t listened to enough of Joe Dante’s, but he’s just fabulous at screenings. John Sayles, both in-person and on commentaries, is always excellent, too

[hearthesilence]

I really hope someone like Criterion reissues The Second Civil War and let Dante record a full commentary. It seems a bit under the radar for a boutique label, partly because it was shown as an HBO movie in the U.S. and the DVD didn't exactly fly off the shelves, but it's really deserving of a revival and re-evaluation, especially now that the world has gone to shit for reasons thoroughly and viciously satirized in the film.

Despite its origins as an HBO production, the film would definitely benefit from a UHD - it was shot on 35mm and genuine 35mm prints (i.e. properly struck from only film elements, not from some broadcast video master) were created as it was theatrically distributed in Europe. Dante even presented his own personal print at BAM in 2016 FREE of charge, one of the best retrospectives BAM ever put on for anybody. I imagine even he sensed that a dire result of the approaching election was very much a possibility, and it was more important to get people to see it rather than ask for an admission fee.

Since it was an introduction, his remarks were brief, but they laid out plenty of ground that could be explored in a commentary - for example, there were fights with the network over the content, and he did have to make at least a few compromises, but even then, he believed the final result was very much one of his best films.

[beamish14]

I really hope someone like Criterion reissues The Second Civil War and let Dante record a full commentary. It seems a bit under the radar for a boutique label, partly because it was shown as an HBO movie in the U.S. and the DVD didn't exactly fly off the shelves, but it's really deserving of a revival and re-evaluation, especially now that the world has gone to shit for reasons thoroughly and viciously satirized in the film.

Despite its origins as an HBO production, the film would definitely benefit from a UHD - it was shot on 35mm and genuine 35mm prints (i.e. properly struck from only film elements, not from some broadcast video master) were created as it was theatrically distributed in Europe. Dante even presented his own personal print at BAM in 2016 FREE of charge, one of the best retrospectives BAM ever put on for anybody. I imagine even he sensed that a dire result of the approaching election was very much a possibility, and it was more important to get people to see it rather than ask for an admission fee.

Since it was an introduction, his remarks were brief, but they laid out plenty of ground that could be explored in a commentary - for example, there were fights with the network over the content, and he did have to make at least a few compromises, but even then, he believed the final result was very much one of his best films.

Dante was given carte blanche to curate about two weeks worth of programming at the New Beverly about 10+ years ago, and he screened it there as well. He maintains a very large joint film collection with producer Jon Davison that is housed at the Academy Film Archive and he has tons of one-of-a-kind prints of lost underground 70’s films and his own stuff like The Movie Orgy (which I suspect he liberated into the wild a few years ago).

You wonder how someone as genuine and nice as him actually made it so far in Hollywood

[hearthesilence]

I credit Spielberg, he really championed Dante and opened a lot of doors for him. In a lot of ways, I generally prefer Spielberg's work as a producer over his work as a director, at least during the '80s before he produced mountains of crap like The Flinstones, Casper and Transformers. To be fair, the stuff he produced is inseparable from his work as a director as everything he produced for Dante, Zemeckis and others during the '80s had his creative input, but conversely he gave them a lot of control and freedom, and in a lot of ways those films feel like they're either responding to Spielberg's cinema or engaged in a dialogue with his vision of the world.

[beamish14]

I credit Spielberg, he really championed Dante and opened a lot of doors for him. In a lot of ways, I generally prefer Spielberg's work as a producer over his work as a director, at least during the '80s before he produced mountains of crap like The Flinstones, Casper and Transformers. To be fair, the stuff he produced is inseparable from his work as a director as everything he produced for Dante, Zemeckis and others during the '80s had his creative input, but conversely he gave them a lot of control and freedom, and in a lot of ways those films feel like they're either responding to Spielberg's cinema or engaged in a dialogue with his vision of the world.

Don’t forget Cats as well! Amazing how he kept his name on that (and his direct involvement was being referenced on Tiny Toon Adventures decades before it went into production) but not Kevin Reynolds’ wonderful and heartfelt Fandango

[Maltic]

Beyond his own films, the conversation Dante had with Kevin McCarthy and Dana Wynter for the Siegel Invasion of the Body Snatchers DVD (and later BD's) is both charming and thoughtful. Often these commentaries with elderly cast members pulled out of retirement can be a little awkward and not so informative.

[Orlac]

I credit Spielberg, he really championed Dante and opened a lot of doors for him. In a lot of ways, I generally prefer Spielberg's work as a producer over his work as a director, at least during the '80s before he produced mountains of crap like The Flinstones, Casper and Transformers. To be fair, the stuff he produced is inseparable from his work as a director as everything he produced for Dante, Zemeckis and others during the '80s had his creative input, but conversely he gave them a lot of control and freedom, and in a lot of ways those films feel like they're either responding to Spielberg's cinema or engaged in a dialogue with his vision of the world.

I'm probably the only person on the planet who likes the Flintstones movie!

[beamish14]

Often these commentaries with elderly cast members pulled out of retirement can be a little awkward and not so informative.

On his commentary for the Twilight Zone episode he appeared in, Cliff Robertson sounds like Troy McClure:

“Hey, kids! You probably know me best as Uncle Ben from Spider-Man!”

[beamish14]

I credit Spielberg, he really championed Dante and opened a lot of doors for him. In a lot of ways, I generally prefer Spielberg's work as a producer over his work as a director, at least during the '80s before he produced mountains of crap like The Flinstones, Casper and Transformers. To be fair, the stuff he produced is inseparable from his work as a director as everything he produced for Dante, Zemeckis and others during the '80s had his creative input, but conversely he gave them a lot of control and freedom, and in a lot of ways those films feel like they're either responding to Spielberg's cinema or engaged in a dialogue with his vision of the world.

I'm probably the only person on the planet who likes the Flintstones movie!

I was just the right age to appreciate the film when it came out, having spent many Sunday afternoons/early evenings watching blocks of Hanna-Barbera cartoons that were made decades before I was born. It really does have quite a few merits, and it was obviously directed by someone who genuinely loves the original property

[hearthesilence]

Still working through William Friedkin's commentary on Vertigo, which honestly feels useless. Worse than useless, not only does he detail everything playing out on-screen as if he was explaining what was going on to a blind and deaf viewer, he gives away what's going to happen before they do. (You should never watch a film with a commentary first, but that's especially the case here.) There's one anecdote that has some value since it's personal - I'll repeat it so you don't have to waste your time with the commentary: apparently Friedkin (who directed the last episode of his TV show) met Hitchcock only one time before he made his name as a film director. He was introduced to him on the Universal lot, and Hitchcock extended his limp hand like he wanted it kissed instead of shaken. Friedkin told Hitchcock how much he looked up to his work, and Hitchcock merely gives him shit for not wearing a tie, then walks away without saying anything else. Then four years later, when Friedkin wins the DGA Award for The French Connection, he sees Hitchcock there. After Friedkin finishes his acceptance speech, he walks down to Hitchcock's seat and as he's grasping the giant plate of an award he's just won, he flashes his tie at Hitchcock's face and says "what do you think of the tie now, Hitch?" Friedkin says Hitchcock doesn't seem to remember him but he doesn't care because he's been carrying Hitchcock's remark for four years and relishes the chance to get back at him.

[colinr0380]

A few interesting, if gloomy, comments from Jonathan Clements in this month's edition of Neo (issue 233). In his section of the "Meet the team" sentence in the contents page we get this:

Disappointed that my commentary track for Gunbuster was binned (along with all the other extras) but super-pleased that a new generation is going to get to see it for the first time.

This has been on Justin Sevakis's channel for months apparently, but I have only just found out that they released Jonathan Clements' commentary for all six Gunbuster episodes!