331 Late Spring

Message

blindside8zao · #126 Post by **blindside8zao** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 8:53 pm

I am looking to purchase my second Ozu on Criterion. The first being Floating Weeds, should I go with this release or something else?

Gigi M. · #127 Post by **Gigi M.** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 9:04 pm

blindside8zao wrote:I am looking to purchase my second Ozu on Criterion. The first being Floating Weeds, should I go with this release or something else?

Go for Tokyo Story.

jorencain · #128 Post by **jorencain** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 9:24 pm

I know that this is sacriligious, but I have seen all of the Criterion Ozu's (they are the only Ozu films I've seen), and "Tokyo Story" is my least favorite. There, I said it. I love the rest of them, and I would suggest "Late Spring". I know I'm in the minority, but I had to put it out there.

#129 Post by **kinjitsu** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 9:48 pm

gigimonagas wrote:Go for Tokyo Story.

Seconded, plus, it includes the very enjoyable two-hour documentary on Ozu's life and work, I Lived, But . . . However, I couldn't live without the entire Noriko Trilogy, so I suggest that you start saving your pennies.

sherlockjr · #130 Post by **sherlockjr** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 10:22 pm

Tokyo Story gets my strong nod as well. Hey, why not get the full impact by watching it with your parents? Okay, there are a lot of built-in assumptions in my last comment, but I can't imagine many more powerful movie-going experiences.

And although I like them all, too, I do think that Good Morning should not be your next stop aboard the Ozu train.

Michael Kerpan · #131 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 10:47 pm

I personally recommend "Early summer" as your next stop on the Ozu Express. A bit lighter in tone -- but the mix of comedy and pathos gets you better prepared for "Late Spring" and "Tokyo Story". And I think it's the most fully satisfactory transfer (given the state of the original material).

My opinion is totally unbiased -- as I love all three of these as much as I possibly can. (all of them more than "Floating Weeds" -- which I also nonetheless love).

Jem · #132 Post by **Jem** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:08 pm

Did anyone else get a thin white line through the screen during the scene where Noriko goes for a bike ride. It's quite prominent.

Michael Kerpan · #133 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:58 pm

Jem wrote:Did anyone else get a thin white line through the screen during the scene where Noriko goes for a bike ride. It's quite prominent.

It's on the Shochiku DVD version too.

manicsounds · #134 Post by **manicsounds** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:09 pm

Beaver shows the Criterion has the line while others don't

Michael Kerpan · #135 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 10:37 pm

Lines are visible on the Shochiku DVD version of this film -- not sure whether they are equally visible -- but they are certainly noticeable at one point during the scene in question.

(I prefer the Shochiku DVD in terms of visual quality -- but no English subs...)

#136 Post by **zedz** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 11:20 pm

Just to complicate matters, that particular still was used in an essay on the film in the French publication Cinema (maybe it was even on the cover), which definitely predates the Criterion DVD. It too had the vertical line.

Jem · #137 Post by **Jem** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:27 am

I am not usually one to complain, but it's such a pivotal scene, why wouldn't Criterion remove it?

Michael Kerpan · #138 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 9:51 am

Because the flaw is so significant that it would take a full-scale (extraordinarily costly) restoration akin to that given to M to fix properly (without doing more harm than good). Criterion does NOT do film restorations -- it only fixes/cleans up sources that it has available.

"Late Spring" is an old film -- with very imperfectly preserved sources. I do not fault Criterion for failing to make it look like new -- as this is an unreasonable expectation. Some older wonderful Ozu films (like "Tokyo Inn") are _very_ damaged -- and I fear that Criterion will never release DVDs of these -- because it does not wish to take flack for releasing DVDs based on (unavoidably) poor materials.

Jem · #139 Post by **Jem** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:03 pm

Michael Kerpan wrote:Criterion does NOT do film restorations -- it only fixes/cleans up sources that it has available.

Then maybe Criterion should look at the wording of their promotions.

FEATURES: New, restored high-definition digital transfer

Thousands of instances of dirt, debris, and scratches were removed using the MTI Digital Restoration System.

Anyway, apart from that minor distraction the film is still wonderful, and the 'restoration' generally good. I would highly recommend it to all (like any of you need me to tell you!)

arsonfilms · #140 Post by **arsonfilms** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:15 pm

Jem wrote:Maybe Criterion should look at the wording of their promotions:

FEATURES: New, restored high-definition digital transfer

Thousands of instances of dirt, debris, and scratches were removed using the MTI Digital Restoration System

I'd just like to point out that while the claim is made to a restored transfer, no such claim is made regarding the print. As such, "New, restored high-definition digital transfer" is accurate.

Meanwhile, the MTI System does a wonderful job of removing thousands of instances of dirt, debris and scratches, but it is unfortunately unable to splice in better sections of negative from other sources on its own, or even remove ALL instances of dirt, debris and scratches. If it were able to do that, the bulk of the frame would be more CGI than film. Thus, thousands of instances seems like a reasonable claim.

Michael Kerpan · #141 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:35 pm

People really do need to look at the feature on the restoration of M (I assume this is included in the Criterion release -- as it was in the UK one). This was a massive (horribly expensive) job -- almost like re-making the film frame by frame. The rescue of M was funded by a foundation -- no mere DVD production company could ever afford to do anything on this magnitude. The University of Tokyo started a demo project of this sort for "Tokyo Story" years ago -- but I don't know if this was ever completed. In any event, Shochiku did not use this for the basis of their new prints (and DVDs) of "Tokyo Story". No restoration effort of this sort has been attempted for any other Ozu film.

peerpee · #142 Post by **peerpee** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 5:30 pm

The film restoration of M was a costly and lengthy process but it mostly involved research and assemblage. The resulting "restored" 35mm brought together much original footage in proper order (for the first time in over 60 years) but it was still quite damaged visually.

The "restoration" of M detailed on the Eureka disc was a digital restoration done, unfortunately, in the PAL domain.

This work could not be used by Criterion as it was in SD PAL.

Criterion's digital cleanup was done completely separately to Eureka's.

kieslowski_67 · #143 Post by **kieslowski_67** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 7:08 am

jorencain wrote:I know that this is sacriligious, but I have seen all of the Criterion Ozu's (they are the only Ozu films I've seen), and "Tokyo Story" is my least favorite. There, I said it. I love the rest of them, and I would suggest "Late Spring". I know I'm in the minority, but I had to put it out there.

Go for "late spring" simply because the Criteiron release of "Tokyo story" is kind of subpar. The contrast is too strong leaving lots of scences way too dark. The Japanese Ozu box features a much nicer transfer on "Tokyo story".

Michael Kerpan · #144 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 9:16 am

I think that Criterion did the best job so far on "Early Summer" (which is pretty equivalent to the Japanese DVD). I think there are parts of "Late Spring" that are overly contrasty (as compared to the Japanese release). As to "Tokyo Story" -- if you have a TV that allows you to adjust contrast, you can tame most of the over-contrast of the Criterion DVD by setting the contrast level at one-fourth to one-third (instead of the neutral halfway point).

Mr Buttle · #145 Post by **Mr Buttle** » Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:22 pm

Hello, Ozu fans. I have a question about the 'Late Spring' DVD. In the scene where the main characters attend a performance of a Noh play, is the play's dialogue subtitled? I already own a DVD of this film, and although its subtitling is otherwise fine, the Noh is left untranslated. This is annoying because Ozu may have chosen a specific play that is relevant to the film's action.

I'm so intrigued that I might consider buying the Criterion edition if the play is subtitled... but is it?

Thanks in advance!

Jimaku · #146 Post by **Jimaku** » Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:48 pm

Mr Buttle wrote:In the scene where the main characters attend a performance of a Noh play, is the play's dialogue subtitled? ... I'm so intrigued that I might consider buying the Criterion edition if the play is subtitled... but is it?

Yes, the play is subtitled in the Criterion edition, and the lyrics are indeed meaningful in the context of the scene.

Murasaki53 · #147 Post by **Murasaki53** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:12 am

You can view the scene (with the Noh play subtitled) here.

I doubt that this is the Criterion, though. I am half-awake and slightly hungover at the moment but it seemed to be comparing life in this world with Amida Buddha's Western Paradise. In other words, the scene acknowledges the beauty and ephemerality of existence whilst envisaging a future transformation (rebirth) to a happier state. The Western Paradise is a kind of Buddhist heaven (one of many) where enlightenment is assured for people who are reborn there. Googling for a bit of information on Pure Land Buddhism (Jodo-shu/Jodo-shinshu) should help.

I don't know which Noh play it is. Can anyone help?

Please note that I haven't actually seen this Ozu movie myself yet but you can bet that I will very soon. It's a great scene.

the dancing kid · #148 Post by **the dancing kid** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 7:19 am

I believe the play is 'Morikawa'.

Michael Kerpan · #149 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 9:37 am

I don't know which Noh play it is. Can anyone help?

Kakitsubata, according to these essays:

Emily and Noriko: Two Cases of Representation of Historical Change

The Scene at the Kyoto Inn: Teaching Ozu Yasujiro's Late Spring (pdf)

La fin du printemps (pdf - in French)

A little bit more about the play.

Mr Buttle · #150 Post by **Mr Buttle** » Sat Jul 21, 2007 2:03 pm

Wow, this is great stuff, guys, lots to process. I'm very grateful.